I could spend an hour writing a new blog giving my thoughts on the penalties the NCAA dropped on the Penn State football program Monday. However, I decided to do something better – post an actual conversation that I had with a (delusional) Penn State fan on Facebook.
The Facebook thread was started by my sports writing friend Brandon Williams. The original status was pretty simple – Penn State’s Judgement Day: Fair or not? Discuss.
I didn’t jump into this thread until about a third of the way through, but when I did, it became a rather heated discussion with the PSU fan. I’m not going to lie, I came out ready to do damage like Drago against Apollo Creed.
I deleted comments by several posters that didn’t factor into this discussion. I will also add editor’s notes along the way.
As with any other Facebook discussion, sometimes replies are posted when you are still typing something, so on occasion it took a couple of instances there is a bit of a delay in responses to specific points.
Here is the thread:
Delusional PSU Fan: You know I got something to say, but I’m too angry to type it now.
PSU: Just to add to the conversation, no one that was involved in this incident was punished by the NCAA today. However, a lot of student-athletes and alumni was.
Dude 1: Paterno was punished by having his name removed from the record books. The loss of scholarships doesnt impact any current students or recruits. It just means fewer kids will come here in 2013 and after. The impact is to neuter the football program, to force the university to stop focusing on that to the exclusion of all else.
PSU: So not going to a bowl for four years stop the problem among the administration? Cutting scholarships will help PSU prevent this from happening again? I don’t think so. And the $$ does not go to the victims, it goes to various child abuse charities.
Dude 2: The football program brings in the most money and they hit them where it hurts. Right in the pocketbook. We are all making a bigger deal out of the football players than they will. Penn State, much like many other universities don’t care about their players they only care about money.
PSU: So if Penn State only cares about money and not the players, why are so many former players and current ones defending the program so much?
Dude 2: Denial. If you can honestly tell me that college programs care about players and not money I will laugh. Look at the facts.
PSU: Penn State’s graduation rankings have been in the top five for the last 10 years. Before this, PSU had no NCAA violations. Every player that has worn the blue and white have been stellar members of society. I know college football is big-time business right now, and looks like it will get only bigger. But Penn State did things the right way, except for dealing with Jerry Sandusky. And that’s the facts.
(Editor’s note: This next guy really started the beat down on the PSU fan)
Dwayne: Money should have been at least doubled (they make that in 1 year) and the family estate should have to pay salary back to university and victims for those years. Excuse money given back to university. Anytime you cover up a crime, there is restitution. Kids won’t suffer, they can transfer without penalty, although it would be hard now. Coaches won’t suffer, they still get paid and they knew this was possible when they came.
PSU: Actually, Penn State football pulls in $53 million a year. So they don’t make double that. And as far as the family playing and restitution, that will all be played out in the civil courts. Not in the NCAA halls.
Dwayne: @PSU, I was speaking of the $60 million that was sanctioned, making THAT in a year. If this was wife of ponzi scheme perpetrator, there would be no hesitation. You cover up CHILD MOLESTATION AND RAPE for all those years, you should not be able to reap financial benefits. Sandusky was removed, but kept office on campus and had access to facilities. RIDICULOUS! DC for 2 national championships but never considered for HC job, hmmmmmmm. Obvious they were keeping the “rapist under wraps.”
Dwayne: Actually, just like insider trading. Paternoster made money based on criminal information that would have affected his tenure.
PSU: That will all be worked out in the civil courts. Has nothing to do with what the NCAA did.
(Editor’s Note: Here’s where I decided to jump in)
Me: The reason the PSU penalties were so harsh is to remind everyone in the country that Universities and Colleges are there for education, not football. The whole reason this scandal happened was because the football program became bigger than the university, not to mention human morals. By crippling the football program, it makes PSU concentrate on bringing kids to their institution because of academics, NOT the football team.
Dwayne: @PSU …I find it RIDICULOUS that the sanctions levied by the NCAA against Penn State is being questioned when the TOO powerful Joe Paterno could have fired Sandusky, banned him for life from Penn State and satellite campuses, and like any teacher is mandated report him to Child Protective Services. I am a high school teacher and coach. I WILL be fired if I know of POSSIBLE child abuse and don’t report it. Joe Paterno covered this up so his reputation would not be tarnished and the program would not be affected. EASY TO SEE!
Pretty obvious to me you are a PSU fan, but I wonder if you have any kids. If so, would you feel the same if Paterno knew what Sandusky was doing for over 10 years, then Sandusky RAPED your child? Would you be supporting PSU so vehemently? Would you want the ” morals clause” of the NCAA member institutions to be honored? HMMMM
PSU: @Dwane : Sandusky retired in 1999. He was given an title which made him a professor-for-life and access to PSU facilities. Paterno did not give him that package, that came from Spanier and the Board of Trustees.
(Editor’s Note: That comment is when I started to realize the extent of the delusion I was dealing with.)
Dwayne: First, It’s Dwayne, i love what my mother named me.
(Editor’s Note: Bwahahahaha)
Now, was Sandusky a tenured professor? What class was he teaching? Was he a full time time professor?
Me: PSU, you are living in a dream world if you think Patero had nothing to do with Sandusky’s package. Seriously, I hope you are enjoying the unicorns and lollipops made in the shape of the PSU logo.
PSU: Also, Paterno did report the incident. His only crime is knowing about the lack of action that the other admins took on Sandusky. Not yet clear if he was directly involved. Should he have done more? Absolutely, he even said so. So I’m not defending him and his legacy, but from what I have heard and seen from him, he was a great man that made a fatal mistake. Also, the man is dead. Not much you can do to him now. What I rather would see is more people go after then-president Graham Spanier than JoePa. He had at least equal (if not more) power than JoePa, and it was his call to keep everything quiet. But no one talks about him because JoePa is the celebrity in all this.
I’m a Penn State alum, but have no kids. This whole incident has shaken me and other alumni. We all deplore what all has happened and have donated money to all kinds of child abuse charities. But let me say this, I didn’t rape any kids. Neither has any PSU alumni. All we’re guilty of doing is supporting our football team. Why should we pay the penalty for the crimes of a group of men?
PSU: Read the report, Joshua. It says JoePa had nothing to do with his retirement package.
(Editor’s Note: Time to take off the kiddie gloves!)
Me: PSU, JoePa had control of everything there. Hell, he damn near hand-picked the president. Stop making excuses for a piece of garbage that was more concerned about a coaching record than he was young boys getting raped by one of his friends. Seriously, you are making yourself look like a damn idiot!
Me: Your defense of JoePa is EXACTLY why the NCAA came down on Penn State like it did. To help you alumni realize that JoePa was trash and that football doesn’t mean everything when it comes to higher education. The sooner you all realize that, the sooner you can help PSU regain its reputation as an institution of higher education.
Dwayne: Doggone it Joshua, I didn’t realize this was a tag team wrestling event. But, TAG HAWK!
PSU: JoePa had a lot of control, maybe too much, but the facts are facts. And we have a Board of Trustees that elects the president, not the football coach. I really think you need to read the Freeh Report before you start calling people idiots.
PSU: I’m not defending JoePa at all. He made a horrible error in judgment and only the Good Lord above will hand him his punishment. But you can’t erase all the good he did for the university and college football in one stroke. Joshua’s statement there just proves that the NCAA wanted to punish the school and its alumni and fans instead of the crimes that happened.
Me: So JoePa had zero influence on the board? Give me a break! And yes, facts are facts. Your beloved football coach is a horrible, horrible person for not doing something about years of child rape. And don’t give me any shit about, “he admits he could have done more.” Any human being with any kind of morals would have gone to the police, no matter what his superiors said or did!
Me: Absolutely the NCAA wanted to punish the university, because you guys still don’t get it. You still view football as sacred at the school. PSU is a institution of higher education, first and foremost. If you all realized that, you would accept these sanctions and move on to restore the University’s reputation that was destroyed by a man that was its face.
Me: If this happened to Pitt or Michigan, I bet you would be all for the sanctions the NCAA issued, Chad.
Dwayne: Well said Joshua!
PSU: The alumni, students, faculty and the Gov. of Pennsylvania picks the Board of Trustees. JoePa did have friends on the board, but they clashed a lot. And the board was the one that fired him, so that influence went out the window.
PSU: We do realize we’re a great institution of higher learning. Check our grad rates lately? So this “football culture” stuff is a copout. You went to Alabama, they already have a statue of Saban there already!!
(Editor’s Note: FOI, I did not attend the University of Alabama. I went to the University of Montevallo. However, I am an Alabama fan. Still the responses are starting to reek of desperation from the PSU fan.)
Me: ”And the board was the one that fired him, so that influence went out the window.” Really? You mean the firing that happened more than a decade after this controversy happened? As I said, you are making yourself look like an idiot, just like Paterno’s family.
PSU: And if it happened at Pitt or Michigan, I would be sadden to hear that innocent student-athletes, coaches, fans, alumni and students would suffer for a long time for the crimes of a few people.
(Editor’s Note: Bullshit!)
PSU: All I can say is that you would be doing the same thing if it happened at your school.
Me: Alabama tradition is that coaches that win a national title get a statue. He’s won two. And if Saban had done what JoePa did, I would watch that statue come down and I would applaud the NCAA right now for crippling the football program. FACT.
Me: I’m a father Chad. Maybe one day, if you have kids, you will look back on your stance today and understand how misguided you are.
PSU: And I’m happy JoePa’s statue came down. It’s a distraction to helping the university move on. I’m not saying that PSU should not be punished, just saying that what we got was too harsh. Nothing else. Everything else about the incident is mentioned in the Freeh Report, and I’m not defending anything else about what happened.
You maybe right about being a father, but think about this. Sandusky’s victims all came from father-less homes, where there was no father-figure there. That alone makes me want to be a father for my kids and for any other guy who wants nothing to do with their kids. Because if they had a father, maybe those kids would have a better life than the ones they have right now.
(Editor’s Note: Here’s where I started going for the knockout shot.)
Me: If you are serious about that, there are plenty of Big Brother organizations out there. Put your time where your mouth is. Stop crying about PSU being banned from bowl games and use this whole ordeal to actually make a difference in someone’s life.
PSU: I’ve already gave money to RAINN, a child sexual abuse charity. Plus like I said before, I didn’t rape any kids or hide what happened. So why should I walk around with a guilty feeling? Why should I be denied a chance to see my team play in a bowl game for four years? I’m fine with the other aspects of the punishment, but I have the right to say that it was too harsh.
Me: As I said, put your TIME (not your money) where your mouth is. Or will you feel too “guilty” by helping kids? Maybe that’s how JoePa thought…
PSU: All I got to say is this… Link: We Are… and Always Will Be.
(Editor’s Note: Glad to see the delusion is rampant amongst PSU fans…)
Me: We Are…And Always Will Be….an athletic program that covered up years of child rape. But hey, we wore blue shirts for the Nebraska game. See we care! Now please don’t take away our bowl games. Don’t deny us this opportunity to cheer on our team in the Ticket City Bowl, even though those children were denied the opportunity to live normal lives. Football means too much to us…
Me: And BTW, with those loss of scholarships, Penn State wouldn’t be bowling the next four years anyway. So really, that’s a moot point.
PSU: As a Bama alum, it could easily happen to you too, so don’t be so quick to vilify a group of people like you’re doing.
(Editor’s Note: Apparently reading comprehension is not an offered course at PSU.)
Me: If you would read my posts as well as you apparently read the Freeh Report, you would see that I said I would applaud the NCAA for making those penalties if Bama had committed the same crimes. Then again, I guess my morals trumph my love of football.
PSU: If you read my previous posts, I said I’m fine with the scholarship loss and the $60 million fine. Just the bowl ban should be two years, not four. Not for love of football, but for fairness.
Me: As I said, with the loss of scholarships, the bowl ban is a moot point. Team is going to suck for at least six years, if not longer.
(Editor’s Note: I think this is important to bring up, because no way PSU gets to six wins with that few of quality players on its roster.)
PSU: I expected PSU to be below-average for five years or so. But at least going to a bowl game in 2014 would help a little in recruiting. But this puts them in a tough situation for a longer while. Just plain sad to me.
Me: Sorry to inform you, but the Ticket City Bowl isn’t helping PSU recruiting.
PSU: Yeah, but it’s better than nothing.
(Editor’s Note: Recruit: “Well, I would go to Penn State, but they didn’t play in the Ticket City Bowl this year. That’s a deal breaker.”)
PSU: Here’s something to ponder…. Link: Michael L. Buckner Law Firm Statement on Reports of NCAA Sanctions Against Penn State
(Editor’s Note: He’s getting really desperate now.)
Me: Too bad Penn State signed off on all of the penalties, so this statement means nothing.
PSU: True, but it does set a dangerous precedent. Hope no Bama players get a DWI or get into a fight, because that might be a one-year bowl ban.
(Editor’s Note: In a thread filled with idiotic statements from this guy, this one took the cake.)
Me: Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. DEEP BREATH. Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.
And at this point, he officially gave up. Much like Drago against Apollo Creed, it was no contest. I annihilated him in this debate.
Couple of things to add:
1) This mindset is exactly why the NCAA came down as hard as it did. Even now, PSU fans are complaining about the penalties on their football team. Get over it! Football should not be the priority at an institution of higher education. For once, the NCAA acted on those values.
2) I am OK with the removal of wins from JoePa’s record. They couldn’t punish him directly because he’s dead. So the next best option – take down his legacy which is why he covered this up in the first place. Good thinking by the NCAA.
I know arguing with a PSU fan about this subject is like arguing with a brick wall. However, I do believe I proved a lot of his comments were idiotic.
Maybe you disagree with me, but I think the NCAA got it right here.
Bear Down and Keep the Faith!